-SubhanAllah-
Junior Member
[yt]bxQwtYodAhE[/yt]
Fitna The Movie: A message to young Muslims in the West
- Thread starter -SubhanAllah-
- Start date
irish_muslim_08
Junior Member
Masha Allah Brother,
That was a very well concieved and delivered response. If only more Mulsims took the time to think about how to respond then that would be a positive thing. I myself am of the opinion of carrying out protests by diplomtic means, the pen is mightier than the sword and Allah asks us to increase our knowledge so I think that the manner of protest you speak of is much more powerful then some forms of protest. Excellent post.
Assalamu alaykum
That was a very well concieved and delivered response. If only more Mulsims took the time to think about how to respond then that would be a positive thing. I myself am of the opinion of carrying out protests by diplomtic means, the pen is mightier than the sword and Allah asks us to increase our knowledge so I think that the manner of protest you speak of is much more powerful then some forms of protest. Excellent post.
Assalamu alaykum
Musa abu A'isha
Aussie Muslim
http://austrolabe.com/2008/03/30/fitna/
So Geert Wilder’s video Fitna has finally been released onto the internet. And what a reaction there has been.
Network Solutions pulled the site that was supposed to be hosting the film. Techcrunch is worried that Google might experience a “Muslim backlash”. Live Leak, who originally hosted the film, have now pulled it down because of “credible threats”. The Singaporean government has condemned it. The UAE government has condemned it. The Council of Europe has spoken out against it. Afghanistan has expressed concern. Former Malaysian prime minister Mahathir has said Malay Muslims are annoyed by it and is calling for a worldwide boycott of Dutch products. Indonesia has condemned it. The OIC naturally condemns it too.
That’s a lot of government and official condemnation for a 17 minute film on Youtube. However, rather than the riots and rivers of blood that the pre-release marketing led us to believe would be the natural consequence of Wilders’ little film, the response from actual Muslims has been, well, not much of a response at all.
As far as such things go, Wilder’s film is quite a weak effort. It’s unlikely to provoke anyone to anything except, perhaps, fall asleep or yawn. Wilders has simply taken various photos and videos of Muslims doing or saying bad or outrageous things (that already exist on the internet at places like MEMRI anyway), thrown in some headlines from Dutch papers, some verses from the Qu’ran, some statistics on Muslim immigration and population growth, and finally added some spooky-sounding music to give, I suppose, gravitas to the whole thing.
The thing that strikes me more than its offensiveness is its lack of originality. Wilders, apparently unable to come up with a suitably offensive shtick of his own, attempts to ride on the coattails of the Danish cartoons; appropriating one of their cartoons — without permission — and using that to start and close his video. He’s now being sued for that. He used footage from an interview with Theo van Gogh without permission. And the owner of that footage is considering legal action too. Where he was original — perhaps too original — was in using the photo of a Dutch-Moroccan rapper instead of a terrorist. He’s now being threatened with legal action for that. Fitna is proving to be more of a fitna for Mr Wilders than for anyone else.
And, as for the content, then, of course, Muslims have done some terrible things in the past and the threat of terrorism is very real and must be confronted by Muslims and non-Muslims alike. However, Wilders’ message isn’t directed at that minority of Muslims who carry out or threaten terrorist attacks but at all Muslims: he views all Muslims as being the “problem”. By doing so, he is intentionally seeking to smear the vast majority of Muslims who find terrorism and violence every bit as abhorrent as the average European non-Muslim; and have, contrary to what some people like to allege, been condemning terrorism every time it has occurred. This is completely counter-productive.
In his comments on Andrew Bolt’s blog, Shibli Zaman makes this point very eloquently and points out the fact that, despite having a large number of Muslims, the United States does not have any issues whatsoever with its domestic Muslim population; which suggests that whatever challenges Europe may face are not the result of the religiousness of their Muslim population but other factors (most notably the welfare state and rigid labour market policies that keep new entrants excluded and therefore alienated). Interestingly, although some of these European “liberals” are very happy demanding that Muslims liberalise their social attitudes, they rarely seem interested in economic liberalisation and making the necessary adjustments that would have a far more appreciable effect than heckling and complaining.
Wilders is not immune to this curious hypocrisy. On the one hand, he and his supporters have rejected the wrongheaded calls for Fitna to be banned; arguing, quite rightly, that freedom of speech and expression must be protected (even if that speech offends some members of society). And yet, on the other hand, a key component of Wilder’s “final solution” to the European Muslim question, is to ban the Qu’ran because he doesn’t like its content.
So Geert Wilder’s video Fitna has finally been released onto the internet. And what a reaction there has been.
Network Solutions pulled the site that was supposed to be hosting the film. Techcrunch is worried that Google might experience a “Muslim backlash”. Live Leak, who originally hosted the film, have now pulled it down because of “credible threats”. The Singaporean government has condemned it. The UAE government has condemned it. The Council of Europe has spoken out against it. Afghanistan has expressed concern. Former Malaysian prime minister Mahathir has said Malay Muslims are annoyed by it and is calling for a worldwide boycott of Dutch products. Indonesia has condemned it. The OIC naturally condemns it too.
That’s a lot of government and official condemnation for a 17 minute film on Youtube. However, rather than the riots and rivers of blood that the pre-release marketing led us to believe would be the natural consequence of Wilders’ little film, the response from actual Muslims has been, well, not much of a response at all.
As far as such things go, Wilder’s film is quite a weak effort. It’s unlikely to provoke anyone to anything except, perhaps, fall asleep or yawn. Wilders has simply taken various photos and videos of Muslims doing or saying bad or outrageous things (that already exist on the internet at places like MEMRI anyway), thrown in some headlines from Dutch papers, some verses from the Qu’ran, some statistics on Muslim immigration and population growth, and finally added some spooky-sounding music to give, I suppose, gravitas to the whole thing.
The thing that strikes me more than its offensiveness is its lack of originality. Wilders, apparently unable to come up with a suitably offensive shtick of his own, attempts to ride on the coattails of the Danish cartoons; appropriating one of their cartoons — without permission — and using that to start and close his video. He’s now being sued for that. He used footage from an interview with Theo van Gogh without permission. And the owner of that footage is considering legal action too. Where he was original — perhaps too original — was in using the photo of a Dutch-Moroccan rapper instead of a terrorist. He’s now being threatened with legal action for that. Fitna is proving to be more of a fitna for Mr Wilders than for anyone else.
And, as for the content, then, of course, Muslims have done some terrible things in the past and the threat of terrorism is very real and must be confronted by Muslims and non-Muslims alike. However, Wilders’ message isn’t directed at that minority of Muslims who carry out or threaten terrorist attacks but at all Muslims: he views all Muslims as being the “problem”. By doing so, he is intentionally seeking to smear the vast majority of Muslims who find terrorism and violence every bit as abhorrent as the average European non-Muslim; and have, contrary to what some people like to allege, been condemning terrorism every time it has occurred. This is completely counter-productive.
In his comments on Andrew Bolt’s blog, Shibli Zaman makes this point very eloquently and points out the fact that, despite having a large number of Muslims, the United States does not have any issues whatsoever with its domestic Muslim population; which suggests that whatever challenges Europe may face are not the result of the religiousness of their Muslim population but other factors (most notably the welfare state and rigid labour market policies that keep new entrants excluded and therefore alienated). Interestingly, although some of these European “liberals” are very happy demanding that Muslims liberalise their social attitudes, they rarely seem interested in economic liberalisation and making the necessary adjustments that would have a far more appreciable effect than heckling and complaining.
Wilders is not immune to this curious hypocrisy. On the one hand, he and his supporters have rejected the wrongheaded calls for Fitna to be banned; arguing, quite rightly, that freedom of speech and expression must be protected (even if that speech offends some members of society). And yet, on the other hand, a key component of Wilder’s “final solution” to the European Muslim question, is to ban the Qu’ran because he doesn’t like its content.
-SubhanAllah-
Junior Member
Assalamu Alaikum
Just to make it clear, I'm not the speaker on this video, what I did was compile this video using the audio of this brother, may Allah (swt) reward him for his words and effort. Ameen.
Just to make it clear, I'm not the speaker on this video, what I did was compile this video using the audio of this brother, may Allah (swt) reward him for his words and effort. Ameen.
nyerekareem
abdur-rahman
:salam2:
yesterday, i wrote a blog about the video and posted it here on TTI. alhamdulillah i got positive responses from it. i just began thinking about the different muslim governments in the world and how they're complaining about the imagery in the video; yet these governments are failing to stop people that have hijacked and gone into extremes in our religion from doing what they are doing. we have been giving fuel for the enemies of islam, so that they may use it against us. we always have to do opposite of the disbelievers in islam. if they support zinaa, we have to promote chastity, if they support liquor, we support tea etc. since they are being very hateful right now, we must be peaceful.
yesterday, i wrote a blog about the video and posted it here on TTI. alhamdulillah i got positive responses from it. i just began thinking about the different muslim governments in the world and how they're complaining about the imagery in the video; yet these governments are failing to stop people that have hijacked and gone into extremes in our religion from doing what they are doing. we have been giving fuel for the enemies of islam, so that they may use it against us. we always have to do opposite of the disbelievers in islam. if they support zinaa, we have to promote chastity, if they support liquor, we support tea etc. since they are being very hateful right now, we must be peaceful.
abrother4truth
New Member
Why are you concerned with Fitna if you have not even seen it? Is it not stupidity to watch a reply without even seeing the content to which the reply is based? Why do you fear Fitna?
*Saniyah*
ukhtikum fillaah
I don't think anyone here fears this so called movie. I saw it and it was a big waste of my precious 17 minutes.
Many youtube-obsessed with "threat" of Islam-users have done similar anti-islamic videos before this racist scum.
All those verses taken out of context have been explained many times before and those who look for the truth will find it, if God wills.
I suppose you enjoyed the movie?
Allah_ka_banda
New Member
Yes it is a Fitna
aslaam u alykum to all my bros and sis out ter
Fitna.........yes it is one of the fitna which our beloved Prophet (peace be upon him) warned us 1400 years ago.........he said fitnas will arise........and muslims wont be able to do anything....although they will be in millions but just like the foam of sea.......
I have not and would not see the movie...coz movies are not meant to be seen by muslims...coz they are drama .... a lie....any movie created is a lie presented in an entertaining way...WHY SHOULD WE SEE A MOVIE???
And if others are seeing then why should we react to a movie???
Its so strange...it is just like if you see a dream in which your wife is beating you and you get up in the morning and argue with her...that "I am a good person...and why did you beat me":ma:it would be a foolish fight...I hope you understand what I mean...
The main purpose for me writing this is not to discuss the movie but to discuss THE MUSLIMS.....do we think the movie is more insult to our Prophet (peace be upon him), to Islam, to Allah (SWT) ....or it is we muslims all over the world that are more insult???
I dont mind if you dont agree with me but in my opinion the way we muslims are living our lifes is more insulting to Islam than anything on this world...
If your father or mother asks you to go get some water for them and you say " I cant....I am going out with my friends...will come back and give it....or take yourself I am busy...etc etc".............will not be that an insult to them....??? and it wont be less than an insult if your friend draws a cartoon of your parents....your parents wont mind the cartoon because it is made by your friend not you...but they sure will mind your attitude towards them...
Same is the relation between Islam and Muslims.......JUST OBEY ISLAM....DO WHAT ISLAM HAS ASKED YOU TO DO....AND FOR SURE ALLAH WONT ASK YOU ABOUT THE MOVIE....BUT YES ALLAH WILL ASK YOU ABOUT THE MOVIE IF YOU ARE NOT PERFECT BECAUSE YOU HAVE YOURSElF OPEN A PATH FOR THEM TO DO THESE THINGS......i wont go much further but to mention a few points....
1-Islam has told us not to make partners with Allah in anykind of worship....but we muslims do it.
2-Islam has told us to obey your parents.......but we muslims dont do it
3-Islam has told us to pray 5 times........but we muslims dont do it
4-Islam has told us not to listen to music.........but we muslims all over the world do listen.
5-Islam has told us to be good.......but ............???
These are just 5 out many points that we muslims are going against...so who is more insulting to Islam ........??? Answer yourself I dont need to mention it...TRY BEING GOOD AND GOOD WILL COME TO YOU
I know many of young muslims wont accept my opinion.......but think over it ........
aslaam u alykum to all my bros and sis out ter
Fitna.........yes it is one of the fitna which our beloved Prophet (peace be upon him) warned us 1400 years ago.........he said fitnas will arise........and muslims wont be able to do anything....although they will be in millions but just like the foam of sea.......
I have not and would not see the movie...coz movies are not meant to be seen by muslims...coz they are drama .... a lie....any movie created is a lie presented in an entertaining way...WHY SHOULD WE SEE A MOVIE???
And if others are seeing then why should we react to a movie???
Its so strange...it is just like if you see a dream in which your wife is beating you and you get up in the morning and argue with her...that "I am a good person...and why did you beat me":ma:it would be a foolish fight...I hope you understand what I mean...
The main purpose for me writing this is not to discuss the movie but to discuss THE MUSLIMS.....do we think the movie is more insult to our Prophet (peace be upon him), to Islam, to Allah (SWT) ....or it is we muslims all over the world that are more insult???
I dont mind if you dont agree with me but in my opinion the way we muslims are living our lifes is more insulting to Islam than anything on this world...
If your father or mother asks you to go get some water for them and you say " I cant....I am going out with my friends...will come back and give it....or take yourself I am busy...etc etc".............will not be that an insult to them....??? and it wont be less than an insult if your friend draws a cartoon of your parents....your parents wont mind the cartoon because it is made by your friend not you...but they sure will mind your attitude towards them...
Same is the relation between Islam and Muslims.......JUST OBEY ISLAM....DO WHAT ISLAM HAS ASKED YOU TO DO....AND FOR SURE ALLAH WONT ASK YOU ABOUT THE MOVIE....BUT YES ALLAH WILL ASK YOU ABOUT THE MOVIE IF YOU ARE NOT PERFECT BECAUSE YOU HAVE YOURSElF OPEN A PATH FOR THEM TO DO THESE THINGS......i wont go much further but to mention a few points....
1-Islam has told us not to make partners with Allah in anykind of worship....but we muslims do it.
2-Islam has told us to obey your parents.......but we muslims dont do it
3-Islam has told us to pray 5 times........but we muslims dont do it
4-Islam has told us not to listen to music.........but we muslims all over the world do listen.
5-Islam has told us to be good.......but ............???
These are just 5 out many points that we muslims are going against...so who is more insulting to Islam ........??? Answer yourself I dont need to mention it...TRY BEING GOOD AND GOOD WILL COME TO YOU
I know many of young muslims wont accept my opinion.......but think over it ........
Allah_ka_banda
New Member
Yes it is a Fitna
aslaam u alykum to all my bros and sis out ter
Fitna.........yes it is one of the fitna which our beloved Prophet (peace be upon him) warned us 1400 years ago.........he said fitnas will arise........and muslims wont be able to do anything....although they will be in millions but just like the foam of sea.......
I have not and would not see the movie...coz movies are not meant to be seen by muslims...coz they are drama .... a lie....any movie created is a lie presented in an entertaining way...WHY SHOULD WE SEE A MOVIE???
And if others are seeing then why should we react to a movie???
Its so strange...it is just like if you see a dream in which your wife is beating you and you get up in the morning and argue with her...that "I am a good person...and why did you beat me":ma:it would be a foolish fight...I hope you understand what I mean...
The main purpose for me writing this is not to discuss the movie but to discuss THE MUSLIMS.....do we think the movie is more insult to our Prophet (peace be upon him), to Islam, to Allah (SWT) ....or it is we muslims all over the world that are more insult???
I dont mind if you dont agree with me but in my opinion the way we muslims are living our lifes is more insulting to Islam than anything on this world...
If your father or mother asks you to go get some water for them and you say " I cant....I am going out with my friends...will come back and give it....or take yourself I am busy...etc etc".............will not be that an insult to them....??? and it wont be less than an insult if your friend draws a cartoon of your parents....your parents wont mind the cartoon because it is made by your friend not you...but they sure will mind your attitude towards them...
Same is the relation between Islam and Muslims.......JUST OBEY ISLAM....DO WHAT ISLAM HAS ASKED YOU TO DO....AND FOR SURE ALLAH WONT ASK YOU ABOUT THE MOVIE....BUT YES ALLAH WILL ASK YOU ABOUT THE MOVIE IF YOU ARE NOT PERFECT BECAUSE YOU HAVE YOURSElF OPEN A PATH FOR THEM TO DO THESE THINGS......i wont go much further but to mention a few points....
1-Islam has told us not to make partners with Allah in anykind of worship....but we muslims do it.
2-Islam has told us to obey your parents.......but we muslims dont do it
3-Islam has told us to pray 5 times........but we muslims dont do it
4-Islam has told us not to listen to music.........but we muslims all over the world do listen.
5-Islam has told us to be good.......but ............???
These are just 5 out many points that we muslims are going against...so who is more insulting to Islam ........??? Answer yourself I dont need to mention it...TRY BEING GOOD AND GOOD WILL COME TO YOU
I know many of young muslims wont accept my opinion.......but think over it ........
aslaam u alykum to all my bros and sis out ter
Fitna.........yes it is one of the fitna which our beloved Prophet (peace be upon him) warned us 1400 years ago.........he said fitnas will arise........and muslims wont be able to do anything....although they will be in millions but just like the foam of sea.......
I have not and would not see the movie...coz movies are not meant to be seen by muslims...coz they are drama .... a lie....any movie created is a lie presented in an entertaining way...WHY SHOULD WE SEE A MOVIE???
And if others are seeing then why should we react to a movie???
Its so strange...it is just like if you see a dream in which your wife is beating you and you get up in the morning and argue with her...that "I am a good person...and why did you beat me":ma:it would be a foolish fight...I hope you understand what I mean...
The main purpose for me writing this is not to discuss the movie but to discuss THE MUSLIMS.....do we think the movie is more insult to our Prophet (peace be upon him), to Islam, to Allah (SWT) ....or it is we muslims all over the world that are more insult???
I dont mind if you dont agree with me but in my opinion the way we muslims are living our lifes is more insulting to Islam than anything on this world...
If your father or mother asks you to go get some water for them and you say " I cant....I am going out with my friends...will come back and give it....or take yourself I am busy...etc etc".............will not be that an insult to them....??? and it wont be less than an insult if your friend draws a cartoon of your parents....your parents wont mind the cartoon because it is made by your friend not you...but they sure will mind your attitude towards them...
Same is the relation between Islam and Muslims.......JUST OBEY ISLAM....DO WHAT ISLAM HAS ASKED YOU TO DO....AND FOR SURE ALLAH WONT ASK YOU ABOUT THE MOVIE....BUT YES ALLAH WILL ASK YOU ABOUT THE MOVIE IF YOU ARE NOT PERFECT BECAUSE YOU HAVE YOURSElF OPEN A PATH FOR THEM TO DO THESE THINGS......i wont go much further but to mention a few points....
1-Islam has told us not to make partners with Allah in anykind of worship....but we muslims do it.
2-Islam has told us to obey your parents.......but we muslims dont do it
3-Islam has told us to pray 5 times........but we muslims dont do it
4-Islam has told us not to listen to music.........but we muslims all over the world do listen.
5-Islam has told us to be good.......but ............???
These are just 5 out many points that we muslims are going against...so who is more insulting to Islam ........??? Answer yourself I dont need to mention it...TRY BEING GOOD AND GOOD WILL COME TO YOU
I know many of young muslims wont accept my opinion.......but think over it ........
